April 7, 2021 at 11:27 pm #72264Patricia N.Participant
“Rabbi Lazer Brody stated, “When you hear that the Russians have captured the city of Crimea, you should know that the times of the Messiah have started, that his steps are being heard. And when you hear that the Russians have reached the city of Constantinople [today’s Istanbul], you should put on your Shabbat clothes and don’t take them off, because it means that the Messiah is about to come any minute.”
April 8, 2021 at 12:10 am #72266Patricia N.Participant
April 8, 2021 at 1:45 pm #72287Todd TomlinsonParticipant
April 8, 2021 at 2:02 pm #72289
April 8, 2021 at 2:13 pm #72295gratefulforgraceParticipant
April 8, 2021 at 2:18 pm #72297
April 9, 2021 at 12:39 am #72311
In Ezekiel 38 it mentions God Wrath. We are not appointed to wrath so we will not be here for that. One would have to think that there would be a few born again Christians in Gog’s army. They would have to be gone before God’s Wrath was poured out.
Judgment on Gog
18 “And it will come to pass at the same time, when Gog comes against the land of Israel,” says the Lord God, “that My fury will show in My face. 19 For in My jealousy and in the fire of My wrath I have spoken: ‘Surely in that day there shall be a great earthquake in the land of Israel, 20 so that the fish of the sea, the birds of the heavens, the beasts of the field, all creeping things that creep on the earth, and all men who are on the face of the earth shall shake at My presence. The mountains shall be thrown down, the steep places shall fall, and every wall shall fall to the ground.’ 21 I will call for a sword against Gog throughout all My mountains,” says the Lord God. “Every man’s sword will be against his brother. 22 And I will bring him to judgment with pestilence and bloodshed; I will rain down on him, on his troops, and on the many peoples who are with him, flooding rain, great hailstones, fire, and brimstone. 23 Thus I will magnify Myself and sanctify Myself, and I will be known in the eyes of many nations. Then they shall know that I am the Lord.” ’
April 9, 2021 at 1:25 pm #72324
I think the rabbis take on this is a perfect representation of what Paul talked about in I Corinthians 2 about the natural man’s discernment vs. the spiritual man’s discernment. Gog is a supernatural entity that will command a supernatural army who, for a specific purpose and on a specific day, arises to set upon Israel. How that gets reduced to Russia taking Crimea, I will never know.
Amos 7:1 in the Septuagint tells us Gog is the king of the locusts. This is part of the reason we know Ez 38 is pre-70th Week. When next we’re introduced to the locusts, it’s in Rev 9 and Gog isn’t their king anymore because God already disposed of him. Abbadon/Apollyon is. There is nothing natural about Ez 38-39 except for the hangers’ on who use the opportunity to join Gog for their own ends.
April 9, 2021 at 2:16 pm #72330
(How that gets reduced to Russia taking Crimea, I will never know”)
That is because what you’re referencing are 2 separate events. The locust that comes out of the bottomless pit in Revelation 9 occurs AFTER the 7th seal is broken and included in the Trumpet Judgments.
If you look back at Revelation 6
1st seal broken White Horse (AC is on center stage)
2nd seal broken Red Horse (war unfolds) most watchers place the first G/M War in this time slot. The Ezekiel 38:18-23 passage that Arthur references … clearly shows God’s wrath is against human beings (many nations – includes Russia, Iran, Turkey, etc. ) … blood shed is going to occur. I don’t think locust/demons have blood. Humans are going after the spoils that Israel has .. why would locust/demons go after the spoils of oil/gas/ technology, etc.?
The purpose of the locust/demons that come out of the pit of hell in Chapter 9 is to torment (sting) the unsaved for 5 months that have taken the mark and worshipping the beast. They are told not to hurt the grass, any green thing nor the trees and they are not to bother the tribulation saints that have the seal of God in their foreheads.
Judgment on Gog Ezekiel 38:18-23
18 “And it will come to pass at the same time, when Gog comes against the land of Israel,” says the Lord God, “that My fury will show in My face. 19 For in My jealousy and in the fire of My wrath I have spoken: ‘Surely in that day there shall be a great earthquake in the land of Israel, 20 so that the fish of the sea, the birds of the heavens, the beasts of the field, all creeping things that creep on the earth, and all men who are on the face of the earth shall shake at My presence. The mountains shall be thrown down, the steep places shall fall, and every wall shall fall to the ground.’ 21 I will call for a sword against Gog throughout all My mountains,” says the Lord God. “Every man’s sword will be against his brother. 22 And I will bring him to judgment with pestilence and bloodshed; I will rain down on him, on his troops, and on the many peoples who are with him, flooding rain, great hailstones, fire, and brimstone. 23 Thus I will magnify Myself and sanctify Myself, and I will be known in the eyes of many nations. Then they shall know that I am the Lord.”
- This reply was modified 1 week, 2 days ago by Geri9.
April 9, 2021 at 2:51 pm #72335churchgalParticipant
I was thinking that G/M has to happen before the 70th week because the covenant has to be confirmed with Israel and that is what initiates the 70th week and thus the seals; and it has been mentioned that more countries will be content and eager to sign the covenant with Israel once the Lord steps in and destroys those that come against her in the G/M war. Once we are gone, the supernatural evil forces will be free to get busy with their plan and deception which will likely include ET type things ( which we have all talked about) and that would represent the supernatural forces? I am just talking out loud and jumping in the discussion, certainly not dogmatic about any of it with the exception of pre-trib rapture…….hehe
April 9, 2021 at 3:33 pm #72338
I know they are different. That was my point. Their leadership is different in the 70th Week than it is before the 70th Week. That tells you Gog and Magog is pre-70th Week and it’s a supernatural event given who Gog and Gogs army are. That’s why I said Russia invading Crimea as the start of it makes no sense. That ain’t supernatural, and Crimea ain’t Israel. Ez 38 regards Israel.
April 9, 2021 at 3:43 pm #72341
Gog is a prince. That’s short for principality, like Ephesians 6 talks about. We wrestle not against flesh and blood but against principalities, against powers, against rulers of the darkness, and spiritual wickedness in high places.
High places = reference to the “north parts” and the mount of the congregation in the sides of the north”. North parts are referred to in Ez 38.
Gog is not the prince of Russia. He’s the rosh or “head/chief” prince. Like Rosh Hashanah means “head of the year”, Gog isn’t the prince of Rosh. He’s the rosh prince… head prince… of Meschech and Tubal. Chief prince who is also king of the locust army. But Meschech and Tubal is the geographic region he’s prince over. Like Daniel’s prince of Grecia and prince of Persia, and Michael the Great prince, and the AC who’s the prince of the people who shall destroy the city and sanctuary, and Messiah the Prince.
April 10, 2021 at 7:02 am #72348
I think we have to keep in mind though that Magog was a grandson of Noah (Genesis 10:2). The descendants of Magog settled to the far north of Israel, likely in Europe and northern Asia (Ezekiel 38:2). Magog seems to be used to refer to “northern barbarians” in general, but likely also has a connection to Magog the person. The people of Magog are described as skilled warriors (Ezekiel 38:15; 39:3-9). So that is why I feel we can’t always link Gog/Magog to demonic forces in every passage we read. The Ezekiel war is going to be a bloodbath and as far as I know only humans have blood. So I lean that it will be real people fighting that war including Russia is involved not just Turkey and Iran, etc. with perhaps using A.I equipment that will burn for 7 years.
April 10, 2021 at 9:38 am #72350
Not to keep arguing this point, but it’s important in the scope of being able to dismiss things of hand when you know they’re completely wrong. Do we see current events align with the people groups we see mentioned in the prophecy to aid our understanding of why they would align with Gog for the purposes of despoiling Israel? Yes.
And yes, he is Gog of Magog, chief prince of Meschech and Tubal. He is supernatural, and his army is going to be supernatural. Even so, there will be many natural people with him. The prophecy states they will gather to him, like one would to an outpost. They will ascend and come like a cloud to cover the land, Gog and all his bands with him. Horses, horsemen, bows, spears, armor. It’ll be an army and a vast one at that, so large that it will take 7 years to burn all their weapons. And it’s likely that it would last beyond the 7 save for the fact that Jesus comes back and burns all the rest of it up, along with the earth and the works therein.
We can link it to the supernatural, because the Septuagint mentions giants twice in Ezekiel 39.
I’m now bowing out of this conversation. Have a blessed day, everyone!
April 10, 2021 at 11:27 am #72353Boulder95Participant
April 10, 2021 at 3:51 pm #72360
Well … I think what it all comes down to is … those who believe Russia is part of the Gog/Magog armies are on extra high alert right now watching Putin’s next move vs. those who don’t believe Russia is not part of the alliance of invading nations … are leaning the Gog/Magog war is a future war.
In the first G/M war – Ezekiel 38-39 – the Lord gathers the attacking armies (hook in the jaw). It takes 7 years to burn the weapons/military equipment and 7 months to get rid of all the bodies (Ezekiel 39:9-12). The commander in charge gets buried “East of the Sea” in the Valley of Harmon Gog. I just googled where Valley of Harmon Gog is located … it’s referring me to Dibon, Jordan … and the nearest sea is the “Dead Sea”.
The 2nd G/M war – Revelation 20 – Satan gathers the attacking armies. The commander of that group (the devil) gets thrown into the Lake of Fire and joins the beast/AC & False Prophet.
April 11, 2021 at 4:13 am #72371
While the invasion of Crimea or war with Ukraine are not part of Bible prophecy, the fact that the Russian Bear is being stirred up bears (pardon the pun) watching.
If the Gog Magog war starts pre rapture, it would give the 7 years to burn the weapons for fuel.
Whatever the case, things are heating up.
April 11, 2021 at 8:25 am #72374
Yep, I agree. We need to stay alert and watching … the bear sees that the eagle (USA) is weak and now is his time to charge and invade.
Looks like Putin means business and plans on winning the war in Ukraine … he deployed lots of human soldiers to the border. 2 warships armed with cruise missiles and gun boats to the Black Sea. He also sent over his toys of A.I. unmanned tanks … he already tested them out in Syria and they were a success.
Word on the
streetinternet … here are 4 conversations I thought were interesting …
I’ve heard Russia is deploying 250,000. This is certainly ww3. The United States has done a rush order on 200 artic vehicles that carry troops to go fight Russia in the Artic. Death on a scale never seen before is about to happen in the world. Please Jesus Christ our lord and savior come get us!
And I thought I heard about somebody intend to use Nuclear Weapons
Yea one of the Russian leaders said they will use them if nato interferes
Mystery Babylon USA Is going to be invaded by Russian and Chinese troops. First the EMP will be launched on USA from the enemy and it WILL hit USA which shuts off electronics all over the USA. USA won’t even know what hit them and what is going to happen next. Then nuclear bombs from Russian/Chinese nuclear submarines start flying towards USA main cities. New York is one of the cities which will be main hit target and will be 100% history. It is obvious that it will all happen in sync all over the World with Taiwan and Ukraine. Be Warned.
– Fair Use –
So who knows if this is truly it … just staying alert …
April 12, 2021 at 3:57 pm #72410
April 12, 2021 at 4:31 pm #72414
April 12, 2021 at 6:25 pm #72417
💣 💣 💣 💣
Per Sean Osborne @ Eschatology Today … 4/12/21
Here they are, the three greatest threats to another world war involving nuclear-armed combatants:
Russia and Belarus vs. Ukraine (and NATO).
Communist China vs Nationalist Taiwan (and U.S./Japan).
Israel vs. Iran (and Syria).
– Fair Use –
I think N. Korea vs. the world needs to also be added to list …
April 12, 2021 at 10:01 pm #72438BlueParticipant
April 12, 2021 at 10:32 pm #72441
I am not sure where the idea that Gog and his army are supernatural. He and his armies will be buried, after all. Ezekiel 39 talks about bones. Sounds pretty human to me.
Bring Out Your Dead
Nathan Jones: Ezekiel 39:11-16 continues explaining the aftermath of the Gog and Magog War. It’s not just the weapons that were left behind by the invaders being destroyed, but a massive amount of dead people are left lying around as well. God wipes out the entire invading army, though we do read in Joel a verse that indicates that maybe a sixth of the army does escape and they go to the furthest northern regions, which would be Siberia. So, some of the invaders escape, but overall most of this massive coalition army will have died.
Israel cannot have dead bodies lying all over the place. So, we get to verse 11, “It will come to pass in that day that I will give Gog a burial place there in Israel.” From that verse we know the leader of this invasion, Gog, dies in Israel as well.
“‘The valley of those who pass by east of the sea; and it will obstruct travelers, because there they will bury Gog and all his multitude. Therefore they will call it the Valley of Hamon Gog. For seven months the house of Israel will be burying them, in order to cleanse the land. Indeed all the people of the land will be burying, and they will gain renown for it on the day that I am glorified,’ says the Lord God. ‘They will set apart men regularly employed, with the help of a search party, to pass through the land and bury those bodies remaining on the ground, in order to cleanse it. At the end of seven months they will make a search. The search party will pass through the land; and when anyone sees a man’s bone, he shall set up a marker by it, till the buriers have buried it in the Valley of Hamon Gog. The name of the city will also be Hamonah. Thus they shall cleanse the land.’”
That’s very descriptive of the cleanup that’s going on, isn’t it?
For the Jewish people to have dead bodies around them it is to be ceremonial unclean. So, for seven months Israel is considered ceremonially unclean.
All of the people, and I mean all of them, go out and start burying bodies. They bury them en mass. They set up a valley as a mass grave. The area hasn’t been located because it hasn’t yet been named yet, but it is a generally believed that the valley lies around the Dead Sea area. They will name it the Valley of Hamon Gog, in other words, the valley where Gog is buried. Hamon Gog can also be translated as the multitude of Gog. In that valley, there they will be buried.
There will also be search parties assigned as their job to go out and look for bones, and when found they will send the remains down to Hamon Gog for burial. Because there would be so many bones to bury, the Jews actually build a city next to the valley in order to facilitate this work. It’s kind of like the old gold rush towns when everyone was running out to California. Literally a town would grow up overnight because all of a sudden all that industry would be there looking for gold. Similarly, the town of Hamonah will be set up because there will be so many people finding the dead and burying their bones and dividing up the weapons for fuel. They will have to create an entire city to handle all of the cleanup, and that will be the town of Hamonah. When verse 11 says the burial place will be by the sea, it means by the Dead Sea.
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